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CaptainCabinets

Top 5 all-time starters at your HS?

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Not sure if this has been a thread previously but had to replicate an interesting topic from the GID ... name the top 5 starters all-time for your high school.

One requirement ... must be 2 guards, 2 forwards, and 1 center. Ok to list back-ups if there are more that should make the list.

I will have to think about Heritage Hills over the years.

And ... GO!!

Edited by CaptainCabinets

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Not sure if this has been a thread previously but had to replicate an interesting topic from the GID ... name the top 5 starters all-time for your high school.

One requirement ... must be 2 guards, 2 forwards, and 1 center. Ok to list back-ups if there are more that should make the list.

I will have to think about Heritage Hills over the years.

And ... GO!!

I believe we have had similar topics but its been a few years and didn't have the guard, forward, Center reqiirement.

As far as H Hills I would have Brad Fella as the Center and Phil Wahl one of the guards after that it gets tough.

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I'll take the West side of Greene County... I could probably throw a good list together for Bloomfield but I'll let Cardinal have at that one...

Linton:

G - Woolsey (never seen him play, I think he was 1940's) but he was an Indiana All Star so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

G- ??? some good, but no great guards in last couple decades... B. Jackson is the best I know of... anyone know of 70's / 80's guards?

F- Fougerousse ('13)

F- Poe ('85)

F/C- Karazsia ('13)

Within 8 years, Fougerousse and/or Karazsia will be the only holdovers. Good times coming.

WRV:

G: AJ Graves (Butler) ('04)

G: Matthew Graves (Butler) ('93)

F: Matt Burgess (Indiana State) ('91)

F: Troy Holt (Rose Hulman) ('93)

C: Josh Hallet (Austin Peay) ('93)

...and to think that the last 4 on this list played on the same team along with PG Marc Hostetter (coach Mt. Vernon) who led Southern Indiana to a national championship. If you were talking best 5 all time, I would replace Hallet with another guard, Andrew Graves ('96).

Dugger:

G: Brody Boyd ('00)

G: Ben Boyd ('95)

F: Marty Hale ('86)

F: Joey Hart ('89)

C: Jared Chambers ('98)

Chambers not a center, but he was at least 6'5".... no way he doesn't make the list.

It might be worth noting that if you were taking the best of the best... the 5 best out of the 15 I listed, there is a chance you would take WRV's 5. Brody Boyd and Marty Hale would make a push because of their scoring ability, but it is debatable WRV's 5 best would also be the area's 5 best in a G, G, F, F C lineup.

Edited by basketballjones

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BRIU1976   

My list for Barr-Reeve

pg Logan Graber

sg Ethan Knepp

pf Nick Duncheon

sf Micah Bullock

c. Addison Wagler

2nd five

pg Trey Hughes

sg Jon-Jon Knepp

sf Jeremy Knepp

pf Bryant Knepp

c Bryan Cole

Granted my observations only go back to the early 90's Really interested in seeing some other people's BR opinions

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For the HH list I like the “platoon” system BRUI1976 went with … too hard to narrow down. Couldn’t follow my own rules. J

I have a heavy ‘85 to present bias since that is what I know and somewhat remember. Some may be out of position...

First Platoon

Point Guard - Jason Wilkerson (all-time career assists leader - 320 assists)

Shooting Guard - Tim Denning (Brescia University & all-time leading scorer - 1320 points)

Forward - Jay Cutler (2nd all-time leading scorer - 1131 points)

ForwardPhil Wahl (Played at SIU-Edwardsville)

Center - Brad Fella – (Got D1 offers in baseball, basketball, & football)

Second Platoon
Point Guard - John Wetzel (?) (Struggled to remember the point guards)
Shooting Guard - Ben Lambeck (6th all-time leading scorer-1052) (Biased pick-I set many screens for him)
Forward - Ken Dilger (All-time career leading rebounder – 559 rebounds)
Forward - John Becher (Played at Oakland City and Valparaiso)
Center - Matt Sisley – (Played at Southeast Missouri State)

Edited by CaptainCabinets

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Tecumseh

PG - Adam Lubbehusen (State Champ, Assist Leader, OCU)

SG - Jeremy Broshears (Leading scorer from 99 state team, briefly played at UE)

SF (any position) - Kreig Oxley (believe he had most wins in school history, WVC starter, KWC starter)

PF - Jake Holder (State Champ, Trester Award, Franklin)

C - Brad Pemberton (2nd all-time leading scorer)

I had to put Lubbehusen and Broshears above Zach Adams (all-time leading scorer) because of the rings

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Covington:

G - Tony Dunham or Bryan Hughes (Yes the BR Coach)

G - Al Hardin (Played at IU)

C - James Ludlow

F - Scott Woodrow

F - Dale White (Played at Illinois State; Indiana All Star)

Coach: Dwayne Rater

I am really only familiar with teams beyond 1977 so there may be other players more deserving that played earlier than that. Covington has a very rich basketball history dating back to 1911.....Thru 1991, their overall record was 1,038 and 684. Since that time, they have played at a 70% winning clip or better. They also have the state of Indiana's longest running rivalry, with Attica High School (220 games). Covington is 117-103 in those contests. Interesting stuff if you are a Indiana High School hoops fan.

Edited by CovingtonTrojan88

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For the HH list I like the “platoon” system BRUI1976 went with … too hard to narrow down. Couldn’t follow my own rules. J

I have a heavy ‘85 to present bias since that is what I know and somewhat remember. Some may be out of position...

First Platoon

Point Guard - Jason Wilkerson (all-time career assists leader - 320 assists)

Shooting Guard - Tim Denning (Brescia University & all-time leading scorer - 1320 points)

Forward - Jay Cutler (2nd all-time leading scorer - 1131 points)

ForwardPhil Wahl (Played at SIU-Edwardsville)

Center - Brad Fella – (Got D1 offers in baseball, basketball, & football)

Second Platoon

Point Guard - John Wetzel (?) (Struggled to remember the point guards)

Shooting Guard - Ben Lambeck (6th all-time leading scorer-1052) (Biased pick-I set many screens for him)

Forward - Ken Dilger (All-time career leading rebounder – 559 rebounds)

Forward - John Becher (Played at Oakland City and Valparaiso)

Center - Matt Sisley – (Played at Southeast Missouri State)

Hard to argue with anyone on this list but do have a few comments.

First John Wetzel school record for assist in a season 177. His Senior season was unbelievable but unless my memory is off I believe he was only a 1 year starter.If I remember correctly starting point guard Trent Bates was injured believe in football so Wetzel became the starter so if not for that injury he likely would have never started because that team was loaded with Matt Sisley, Ken Dilger, Field goal percentage leader Klint Arnold and 6'5" shooting guard Steve Schaefer as the other starters so my question is does a player with one great season qualify ??

If so what about Darell Green he was before my time playing in the schools 1st season but holds school record for rebounds in a game 29 and season 270 if HH would have consolidated a few year early guessing that career rebound record Dilger has would have been his.

Also what about Dusty Neighbors ?? Not sure who he would replace though.

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Hard to argue with anyone on this list but do have a few comments.

First John Wetzel school record for assist in a season 177. His Senior season was unbelievable but unless my memory is off I believe he was only a 1 year starter.If I remember correctly starting point guard Trent Bates was injured believe in football so Wetzel became the starter so if not for that injury he likely would have never started because that team was loaded with Matt Sisley, Ken Dilger, Field goal percentage leader Klint Arnold and 6'5" shooting guard Steve Schaefer as the other starters so my question is does a player with one great season qualify ??

If so what about Darell Green he was before my time playing in the schools 1st season but holds school record for rebounds in a game 29 and season 270 if HH would have consolidated a few year early guessing that career rebound record Dilger has would have been his.

Also what about Dusty Neighbors ?? Not sure who he would replace though.

All great points and great players. I struggled to remember a 2nd PG for whatever reason. I heard from someone earlier today that said Darell Green was as tenacious of a player as anyone to ever play at HH. Schaefer was on my list, but had to go with Lambeck since I played with him but do remember watching Schaefer. GREAT TEAMS with a capacity crowd every night!

Great list of Patriots no matter who is on it, IMO!

Edited by CaptainCabinets

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Rockville

Tim Clary

Rich Schelsky

R.J. Mahurin

Lane Mahurin

Bill Newton

I think I would replace Tim Clary with Sam Pharr.

Shelsky PG 5'10

RJ SG 6'9

Lane SF 6'8

Pharr PF 6'9

Newton C 6'11

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Stroke   

I'll take the West side of Greene County... I could probably throw a good list together for Bloomfield but I'll let Cardinal have at that one...

Linton:

G - Woolsey (never seen him play, I think he was 1940's) but he was an Indiana All Star so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

G- ??? some good, but no great guards in last couple decades... B. Jackson is the best I know of... anyone know of 70's / 80's guards?

F- Fougerousse ('13)

F- Poe ('85)

F/C- Karazsia ('13)

Within 8 years, Fougerousse and/or Karazsia will be the only holdovers. Good times coming.

WRV:

G: AJ Graves (Butler) ('04)

G: Matthew Graves (Butler) ('93)

F: Matt Burgess (Indiana State) ('91)

F: Troy Holt (Rose Hulman) ('93)

C: Josh Hallet (Austin Peay) ('93)

...and to think that the last 4 on this list played on the same team along with PG Marc Hostetter (coach Mt. Vernon) who led Southern Indiana to a national championship. If you were talking best 5 all time, I would replace Hallet with another guard, Andrew Graves ('96).

Dugger:

G: Brody Boyd ('00)

G: Ben Boyd ('95)

F: Marty Hale ('86)

F: Joey Hart ('89)

C: Jared Chambers ('98)

Chambers not a center, but he was at least 6'5".... no way he doesn't make the list.

It might be worth noting that if you were taking the best of the best... the 5 best out of the 15 I listed, there is a chance you would take WRV's 5. Brody Boyd and Marty Hale would make a push because of their scoring ability, but it is debatable WRV's 5 best would also be the area's 5 best in a G, G, F, F C lineup.

I'll add my take on Shakamak:

G Jared Rehmel

G Michael Allen

C Steve Fougerousse

F Bill Newton

F Josh McDaniel

Others: Travis Walters, Travis Johnson, Brock Dowell, Jeff Barton

BBJ,

Pretty good list. Not that it matters, but other than Brody Boyd I think you're off on what years the Dugger kids graduated. Pretty sure Hale was 87. I know Hart was 90, Ben Boyd 94, Chambers 97.

Regarding the school's you listed and all-area teams..

Linton - I agree across the board. The empty guard spot I would probably go with Caleb Fischer. Likely some others I'm missing. Fischer was a mid-upper teens/game scorer on a team that was pretty average but did win the Grenee County Tournament. Also worth noting, that was a down period overall for the area. Another option would be (gulp) moving Dess to a guard spot and adding Brock Thuis as a forward. Man that would be interesting locker room dynamics. Having Dess and Thuis on the same team would be (fill in blank).

WRV - Like you mentioned with Chambers, no way does Andrew not make the list. He averaged a triple double as a senior. Again, a triple double. Has that been done by anyone else in this area? He has to be a top 5 all-time SWIAC player. No way he gets left off a WRV list. If I had to leave one of the Graves brothers off it wouldn't be Andrew. Andrew was the only true PG of the 3 Graves brothers. Matthew fits the wing role well. I would move him to forward. Although undersized, Burgess was a true center. The Wagler kid currently playing at Barr Reeve reminds me of cross between Burgess and Jim Cruise who played at THN in the 90's. I would take Burgess over Hallet at the HS level.

So here's my WRV all-time team (post consolidation of course. Including Switz, Lyons, Worthington would make this a real challenge.)

G Andrew Graves

G AJ Graves

F Matthew Graves

F Troy Halt

C Matt Burgess

Dugger - Keeping the format by position, I would subtract Ben Boyd. Move Joey Hart to a guard, Chambers to forward, and add Eric Walters at Center. While they had some very good players over the years, Dugger never had a true standout center. Others who could be considered are David Figg, Jay Smith, and Josh Witgren.

G Joey Hart

G Brody Boyd

F Marty Hale

F Jared Chambers

C Eric Walters

Your all-combined team...I see your point with the WRV players and the argument could certainly be made. However, I'll go a different direction and say there should be 3 Dugger kids. Brody Boyd has to be on it. If we are going by position, Chambers has to be on it over Halt or Burgess. I could be biased, but knowing his competitive will I could never leave Joey Hart off. Based on my earlier comments, obviously I believe Andrew is worthy. I'll make Joey a point forward to make it work. At center I'll go with AK over Burgess or Hallet.

G Andrew Graves

G Brody Boyd

F Joey Hart

F Jared Chambers

C Austin Karazsia

Strokes Team vs BBJ's Team

Andrew Graves / Matthew Graves

Brody Boyd / AJ Graves

Joey Hart / Matt Burgess

Jared Chambers / Troy Halt

Austin Karazsia / Josh Hallet

In my humble opinion, Team Stroke would be favored.

Edited by Stroke

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If I could slide Matthew into the F position for WRV, then Burgess definitely takes over the center position for Hallet, and the team improves. Hallet was 6'11" or maybe 7'0" and had some muscle / coordination, but Burgess was a straight beast for high school hoops. Heck, he was a beast in the Missouri Valley.

Then the matchup becomes:

Andrew Graves / Andrew Graves

Brody Boyd / AJ Graves

Joey Hart / Matthew Graves

Jared Chambers / Troy Halt

Austin Karazsia / Matt Burgess

Man for man, I'll call the 1, 2 and 3 positions a wash, give Chambers the edge at the 4 and Burgess the edge at the 5. And I'm giving WRV the edge because of course the game is being played at Switz!! ;) Besides, Joey and/or Jared would end up punching Brody by halftime and Austin would be dumbfounded that teammates would be capable of such atrocities... Chemistry of Team Stroke would be a nightmare.

And to think there are 3 WRV boys who haven't yet been mentioned... Rusty Miller (Switz City, 75), Tony Patterson (L&M, '85) and Jeff Oliphant (L&M, '85).

Edited by basketballjones

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A couple things... Andrew Graves played like a 3... Halt was a 4/5 mix. Remember Hallatt was often quickly replaced by a quicker Blake Montgomery... or another big like Matt Warrick. Burgess also played more of the 5 at the HS leveBurgess manhandled some college centers at 6'6", so he would be fine. For WRV... It would be...

G A.J. Graves

G Matthew Graves

F Andrew Graves

F Troy Halt

C Matt Burgess

For Linton, Fischer and Thuis don't even crack the top 5 at their position. Thuis wasn't the best player on his own team... the same argument could be made with Fischer. Josh Hall (95) and Riley Beach (?) were as good or better. A few players have been omitted. Simmons (early 70's... led team to sectional title) and Rick Crynes (single season ppg leader). Some guys I only have seen in their older years... or through stories. So here it goes with Linton.

G Max Woolsey- Way before my time, but I heard stories about how he would collapse due to exhaustion. Old timers have told me he was the hardest working player and it isn't even close. The All Star nod is a testament to the respect he garnered.

G- Dess Fougerousse- We can debate his position, but who handled the ball handling duties? Not to mention he holds assist records.

F- Scott Poe- I didn't watch him, but he was a big scorer and prior to AK/Dess... he was the last guy to lead Linton to a sectional title.

F- Larry Simmons- Another guy that I always hear stories about... The way I hear it... 6'4" or 6'5" with a smooth handle and an inside out machine. I guess I always think Dess... minus the big personality.

C- Austin Karaszia- Career speaks for itself. Coach Hart, Dess and AK have put Linton on the map in basketball. I have no doubt Coach Hart will keep us competing for sectionals and beyond.

Some guys that I left out...

Josh Hall- One of the better guards to play at Linton in the last 30 years. 1,000 point scorer, but he did that during the height of basketball in Greene County. He did it against D1/D2 talent on a nightly basis. Scariest thing is he never really focused much on basketball.

Rick Crynes- Big scorer... not sure he could have got enough shots on this all star group.

For Shakamak, leaving off Jim Yeryar (mid 60's right after consolidatiom) would start an uproar in Jasonville. Some would argue he was/is the best to suit up for the Lakers. Way before my time... but he was 20+ ppg scorer on a highly ranked team. I think Cloverdale's powerhouse put them out of the tourney... might have been 1966.

G- Jared Rehmel- Mr. Clutch... not sure how many game winners he notched... but it had to be a lot. One handedly led a group of mediocre role players to a single class semi-state.

G- Michael Allen- I vaguely remember him. Great shooter... absolutely automatic from the FT line.

F- Jim Yeryar

F- Billy Newton- Can't argue with his production... very good HS player. One of the quickest jumpers I've seen.

C- Steve Fougerousse- Unlike Dess, Steve was really a late bloomer. At the 5 spot he would stretch the defense with his shooting... If I'm not mistaken he even grew a little out of HS.

I know I forgetting a big man from the late 70's or early 80's... I think a McNabb was a really good center... may have held a rebounding record for some time... not sure.

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Dugger...

G Brody Boyd- Career should speak for itself.

G Ben Boyd- Those who doubt his ability never watched him play. He and Jared Rehmel occupy a majority of my personal "Wow" memories by a area player. Another guy that put up big numbers against big competition. The SWIAC in the early to mid 90's was a meat grinder with loaded teams. Great shooter... Imagine two shooters whose range starts when they cross halfcourt.

F- Joey Hart- Joey would be the point forward on this team... he might average 20+ assists per game.

F- Marty Hale- I don't really remember Hale as a HS player, but I watched him play after HS... very skilled.

C- David Figg- True center... he may be the only one. I know some one previously put Chambers here, but that wouldn't work... Jared was a 6'5" wing. Not to mention... somebody has to set screens for the Boyd Bombers... I like Figgs chances there... I don't think Jared set screens. Bobby Cox and Justin Cottingham might post up, but Jared rarely played anything but a 3. Jared was smooth, but I see him fighting for a spot with Hale and Hart (unless you disregard Ben and move Joey to a guard). There was a Fulford that played around the same time as Ben Boyd... he was solid. I don't know Eric Walters, so I can't speak intelligently on him as a player.

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Dugger...

G Ben Boyd- Those who doubt his ability never watched him play. He and Jared Rehmel occupy a majority of my personal "Wow" memories by a area player. Another guy that put up big numbers against big competition. The SWIAC in the early to mid 90's was a meat grinder with loaded teams. Great shooter... Imagine two shooters whose range starts when they cross halfcourt.

I don't think Jared set screens.

I agree with Ben Boyd. I've heard his name come up in conversations such as "greatest talent of all time at Dugger" or "was better than Brody"... and never played to his full potential.

"I don't think Jared set screens" I literally laughed out loud.

Did you see Gary Weir (the former official) play???? He was the career leading scorer for a long time at Shakamak and I've heard he was really good... probably not cracking the top 5 but just wondering...

And I agree completely as putting Josh Hall in at the 2 spot for Linton... I can't believe I forgot him. He was older but I remember shooting around with him in his driveway a few times...

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All time team... that is tough. I can't really pick one, so I'll pick my two and reasons why one might edge out the other.

PG- A.J. Graves vs. Jared Rehmel- I know some would argue Brody Boyd should be in the mix, but Brody wasn't really a facilitator within the offense... he was the offense. I know this seems like an easy nod to Graves, but I would argue Jared would give A.J. all he wanted and more. Jared was tenacious in a way A.J. never was. Not to mention... this would be a battle of guys with ice in their veins come crunch time. My head tells me A.J., but my heart says Jared... A.J. but only barely.

SG- Brody Boyd vs. Matthew Graves- Graves just didn't make mistakes, but Brody was a lights out shooter. Speed goes to Brody... size to Matthew. This one would be tough to call... I'll go Matthew in a close one.

SF- Joey Hart vs. Andrew Graves- Another tough one... would Joey be able to get in Andrew's head, or would Graves give his classic surly smirk and just roll his eyes as he physically beats on Hart. Really tough call. Both guys are versatile... I'd take Joey for ballhandling and passing, while Graves was the superior rebounder. I guess it depends on what you want.

PF- Troy Halt vs. Billy Newton- I know Jared Chambers is a possibility here, but I really see him as a wing. Halt would have scored 25+ ppg on any other team. He was the guy nobody had an answer to when WRV made their big runs. Next to Burgess... maybe the strongest player I've seen. He used his body brilliantly. Newton is more of a stretch 4 with some athletic ability. I see Newton out-quicking Halt, but ultimately Halt would physically abuse Newton. Halt

C- Austin Karaszia vs. Matt Burgess- I love AK... great kid... great work ethic, but Burgess is the most physically superior power player I've seen around here at the HS level. I think AK would give him some fits being a bot taller and fairly strong himself, but I watched Burgess dropstep and dunk while 2 guys were holding onto his elbows. Physical beast... AK would have to outsmart him. I'd still take Burgess.

Edited by Greene County Coach

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300Game   

I'll take the West side of Greene County... I could probably throw a good list together for Bloomfield but I'll let Cardinal have at that one...

Linton:

G - Woolsey (never seen him play, I think he was 1940's) but he was an Indiana All Star so I'm giving him the benefit of the doubt on this one.

G- ??? some good, but no great guards in last couple decades... B. Jackson is the best I know of... anyone know of 70's / 80's guards?

F- Fougerousse ('13)

F- Poe ('85)

F/C- Karazsia ('13)

Within 8 years, Fougerousse and/or Karazsia will be the only holdovers. Good times coming.

Linton had several players back in the day.

Scott Poe was '82 not '85

Dewanne Phipps, Larry Simmons, Scott Bedwell, Bryan Slay, Chris Leroux, Greg Elliott.

Your list looks pretty good though.

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My list for Barr-Reeve

pg Logan Graber

sg Ethan Knepp

pf Nick Duncheon

sf Micah Bullock

c. Addison Wagler

2nd five

pg Trey Hughes

sg Jon-Jon Knepp

sf Jeremy Knepp

pf Bryant Knepp

c Bryan Cole

Granted my observations only go back to the early 90's Really interested in seeing some other people's BR opinions

The thing with BR is that there are just too many candiidates. Lots and lots of good players who were all very similar. To my way of thinking there are only 2 locks - those being Addison Wagler and Nick Duncheon. There are literally dozens of players who could make up the other 3 spots. Personally I would probably pick Darren Wilcher and Devon Knepp at the guards and Chris Craney at the other forward. Other players you didn't list but are just as reasonable to pick would be Tom Ash, Jeff Craney, Frank Blake, Ernie Evans, Zane Bowman, Mark Walton, Jeremy Wilson, Darren Helms, Chad Edwards, and on and on.

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Fan   

My list for Barr-Reeve

pg Logan Graber

sg Ethan Knepp

pf Nick Duncheon

sf Micah Bullock

c. Addison Wagler

2nd five

pg Trey Hughes

sg Jon-Jon Knepp

sf Jeremy Knepp

pf Bryant Knepp

c Bryan Cole

Granted my observations only go back to the early 90's Really interested in seeing some other people's BR opinions

No Zane Bowman? WOW

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For Loogootee it is easier, with 4 locks for me being: G Junior Gee, G Bill Butcher, F Jeff Doyle, F Brian Canada. For the center position I'll take Wilmer Wittmer.

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For the Hatchets it's tough because all of the Zellers were centers. I'll go with G Craig Neal, G Ron Arnold, C Tyler Zeller, F John Helm, F Jerry Flake. You could make a case for either of the other Zellers and also for Steve Bouchie who was a better rebounder than any of the Zellers...

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For the Hatchets it's tough because all of the Zellers were centers. I'll go with G Craig Neal, G Ron Arnold, C Tyler Zeller, F John Helm, F Jerry Flake. You could make a case for either of the other Zellers and also for Steve Bouchie who was a better rebounder than any of the Zellers...

Yes, probably a toss-up with any of the Zellers. Just curious, did Tyler have better overall numbers than the other two?

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