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CaptainCabinets

Top 5 all-time starters at your HS?

46 posts in this topic

Yes, probably a toss-up with any of the Zellers. Just curious, did Tyler have better overall numbers than the other two?

No. Luke scored the most points of the 3 and Cody had the most rebounds. The thing is that Luke was much better as a freshman than the other two were, so that skews his career numbers a bit. Just my personal opinion that in his senior year Tyler was a little better than the other two.

Edited by taps browning

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No. Luke scored the most points of the 3 and Cody had the most rebounds. The thing is that Luke was much better as a freshman than the other two were, so that skewes his career numbers a bit. Just my personal opinion that in his senior year Tyler was a little better than the other two.

But Tyler didn't do this ... :)

Still unbelievable!!

Edited by CaptainCabinets

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A couple things... Andrew Graves played like a 3... Halt was a 4/5 mix. Remember Hallatt was often quickly replaced by a quicker Blake Montgomery... or another big like Matt Warrick. Burgess also played more of the 5 at the HS leveBurgess manhandled some college centers at 6'6", so he would be fine. For WRV... It would be...

G A.J. Graves

G Matthew Graves

F Andrew Graves

F Troy Halt

C Matt Burgess

For Linton, Fischer and Thuis don't even crack the top 5 at their position. Thuis wasn't the best player on his own team... the same argument could be made with Fischer. Josh Hall (95) and Riley Beach (?) were as good or better. A few players have been omitted. Simmons (early 70's... led team to sectional title) and Rick Crynes (single season ppg leader). Some guys I only have seen in their older years... or through stories. So here it goes with Linton.

G Max Woolsey- Way before my time, but I heard stories about how he would collapse due to exhaustion. Old timers have told me he was the hardest working player and it isn't even close. The All Star nod is a testament to the respect he garnered.

G- Dess Fougerousse- We can debate his position, but who handled the ball handling duties? Not to mention he holds assist records.

F- Scott Poe- I didn't watch him, but he was a big scorer and prior to AK/Dess... he was the last guy to lead Linton to a sectional title.

F- Larry Simmons- Another guy that I always hear stories about... The way I hear it... 6'4" or 6'5" with a smooth handle and an inside out machine. I guess I always think Dess... minus the big personality.

C- Austin Karaszia- Career speaks for itself. Coach Hart, Dess and AK have put Linton on the map in basketball. I have no doubt Coach Hart will keep us competing for sectionals and beyond.

Some guys that I left out...

Josh Hall- One of the better guards to play at Linton in the last 30 years. 1,000 point scorer, but he did that during the height of basketball in Greene County. He did it against D1/D2 talent on a nightly basis. Scariest thing is he never really focused much on basketball.

Rick Crynes- Big scorer... not sure he could have got enough shots on this all star group.

For Shakamak, leaving off Jim Yeryar (mid 60's right after consolidatiom) would start an uproar in Jasonville. Some would argue he was/is the best to suit up for the Lakers. Way before my time... but he was 20+ ppg scorer on a highly ranked team. I think Cloverdale's powerhouse put them out of the tourney... might have been 1966.

G- Jared Rehmel- Mr. Clutch... not sure how many game winners he notched... but it had to be a lot. One handedly led a group of mediocre role players to a single class semi-state.

G- Michael Allen- I vaguely remember him. Great shooter... absolutely automatic from the FT line.

F- Jim Yeryar

F- Billy Newton- Can't argue with his production... very good HS player. One of the quickest jumpers I've seen.

C- Steve Fougerousse- Unlike Dess, Steve was really a late bloomer. At the 5 spot he would stretch the defense with his shooting... If I'm not mistaken he even grew a little out of HS.

I know I forgetting a big man from the late 70's or early 80's... I think a McNabb was a really good center... may have held a rebounding record for some time... not sure.

Andrew didn't play the 3. He played some 2 his sophomore season. As a jr/sr and at Butler he played the point. Broc Hostetter shared some PG duties with him, but in a big spot or big game Andrew brought the ball up. He was a do it all guy at WRV and certainly could have been a 3, but hes a natural PG.

Im questioning your evaluating ability. Riley Beach was not better than Fischer. Josh Hall wasn't a 2 guard. He was a PG who could care less about basketball. To put him in over Caleb is crazy.when Hall was a Sr I saw Freshman JT Golish handle him with ease. Thuis was better than Hall. Way better. However after thinking about it, their is a player were all forgetting at Linton...Dane Perigo. I'll put him at the 2 over Fischer, Hall, etc. You mention Rick Crynes, he'd be an option but no way he and Dess could play together.

As for Dugger...Hart played guard. But if you're putting Joey at Fwd, Chambers makes it over Hale. I believe Brody and Chambers are the only two Indiana All-Stars from Dugger, and also 1-2 in career scoring. Marty was good, but didnt have the career Jared did. Marty still makes the team becasue Ben does not. Ben may have been the most talented Dugger player, but was a train wreck as a Jr and Sr. His teams were awful and full of chemistry issues. Ironically, Ben was one of the funniest guys I ever met and had a magnetic personality but was considered a selfish player. None of these guys would want to play with him. I would take Doug Boyd, Joe Pigg, and Darren Woodward over Ben. Doug was very good. Joe and Darren were both winners. Justin Cottingham was 6'2, 155lbs. He couldn't shoot or dribble. Very good athlete, but average basketball player. He didn't even start as Sr. Probably averaged 2 points and 2 rebounds if that. Bob Cox was a tough kid who could shoot it, but was a 5'11 wing. And no to Jason Fulford. Eric Walters is hands down better then all mentioned at Center other than Figg. The case could be made either way, but I'll take Eric. For those who don't know, he was a long lanky 6'5 post. Moved well, very cerebral. Graduated in 90 with Joey. My guess is he averaged something like 15ppg and 9-10rpg as a sr.

Edited by Stroke

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But Tyler didn't do this ... :)

Still unbelievable!!

True enough, but Tyler had the best final game of any of the Zellers. I realize the opposition wasn't maybe as good. The thing people forget about "the shot" is that the Hatchets very nearly lost to a team that wasn't nearly as good as they were.

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I believe we have had similar topics but its been a few years and didn't have the guard, forward, Center reqiirement.

As far as H Hills I would have Brad Fella as the Center and Phil Wahl one of the guards after that it gets tough.

The 2002-03 HH team just gets no love (only HH team to win a regional game). As a team, I think they were every bit as good as the 1996-97 team.

And, if memory serves me right, Dusty was hurt and didn't play in the regional games (beat Sullivan, gave it away to Corydon). If Cole had played basketball his senior year ... wow.

Eta: Someone was hurt, apparently Dusty felt well enough to go for 17 and 12.

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The 2002-03 HH team just gets no love (only HH team to win a regional game). As a team, I think they were every bit as good as the 1996-97 team.

And, if memory serves me right, Dusty was hurt and didn't play in the regional games (beat Sullivan, gave it away to Corydon). If Cole had played basketball his senior year ... wow.

I agree that team deserves some love but you are off a bit on your facts Chris.

First Dusty played in regional. I didn't have complete box scores that season but had leading scorers http://www.psci.net/davidm/HHBBall2003.html and Dusty scored 17 VS. Sullivan and 12 VS. Corydon.

2nd it was Not the only HH team to win a regional game.

1982 Evansville Regional Heritage Hills defeated Mount Vernon 65-39 and lost to Bosse 78-50 in the championship game.

1988 Evansville regional Heritage Hills defeated Vincennes 55-52 and lost in the championship game 65-64 to Central, I remember that game like it was yesterday closest we ever came to the title we were up 64-63 Central misses the shot but gets the offensive board and put-back for the win, Patriots were one defensive board from a regional title.

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I agree that team deserves some love but you are off a bit on your facts Chris.

First Dusty played in regional. I didn't have complete box scores that season but had leading scorers http://www.psci.net/davidm/HHBBall2003.html and Dusty scored 17 VS. Sullivan and 12 VS. Corydon.

2nd it was Not the only HH team to win a regional game.

1982 Evansville Regional Heritage Hills defeated Mount Vernon 65-39 and lost to Bosse 78-50 in the championship game.

1988 Evansville regional Heritage Hills defeated Vincennes 55-52 and lost in the championship game 65-64 to Central, I remember that game like it was yesterday closest we ever came to the title we were up 64-63 Central misses the shot but gets the offensive board and put-back for the win, Patriots were one defensive board from a regional title.

Thanks. Yeah, I edited the first one to correct Dusty's totals. Maybe Satterfield was injured?

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Thanks. Yeah, I edited the first one to correct Dusty's totals. Maybe Satterfield was injured?

I Honestly can't remember if someone was injured or not but remembered the 88 game because we came so close, I cheated by looking in the Tourney Time book to find the win over Mount Vernon.

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I agree that team deserves some love but you are off a bit on your facts Chris.

First Dusty played in regional. I didn't have complete box scores that season but had leading scorers http://www.psci.net/davidm/HHBBall2003.html and Dusty scored 17 VS. Sullivan and 12 VS. Corydon.

2nd it was Not the only HH team to win a regional game.

1982 Evansville Regional Heritage Hills defeated Mount Vernon 65-39 and lost to Bosse 78-50 in the championship game.

1988 Evansville regional Heritage Hills defeated Vincennes 55-52 and lost in the championship game 65-64 to Central, I remember that game like it was yesterday closest we ever came to the title we were up 64-63 Central misses the shot but gets the offensive board and put-back for the win, Patriots were one defensive board from a regional title.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didnt that Central team eventually lose to Damon Bailey and Bedford? Must have been semi state. I think Muncie Central and Chandler Thompson rolled Shawn Kemp's Concord team in the championship game that season. Edited by Stroke

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1988 Evansville regional Heritage Hills defeated Vincennes 55-52 and lost in the championship game 65-64 to Central, I remember that game like it was yesterday closest we ever came to the title we were up 64-63 Central misses the shot but gets the offensive board and put-back for the win, Patriots were one defensive board from a regional title.

Wasn't the Vincennes game when David Litkenhus made the 1/2 court short (or may have been farther)? Or do I have my years and games all mixed up?

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Caleb Fischer was a above average player on a Linton team that would have been a bottom feeder in the SWIAC in the early 90's. Josh Hall was an above average player (who had moments of dominance) in arguably the strongest era in SWIAC/Greene County basketball. If you want a steady player that makes some shots... take Fischer, but he is at best a 3rd option on any team Josh played on (behind Josh and a host of other guys). As for Thuis, you obviously never watched him play HS basketball. I love the guy, but dunking and shooting the 3 became more important than translating his athleticism to production. I won't argue that Josh never lived up to his ability... but he actually had top notch ability.

As for Joey, Joey was an amazing guard... but like Andrew Graves he was versatile with his size a ball handling ability. At the college level both were PGs, but I guess I was looking at them as HS players. Joey was really good in HS... lights out after VU and Coastal Carolina.

Ben Boyd had great ability... probably not the best team guy, but then again there were games where he was the only guy that could score. Stringer, Fulford, and Co. could contribute, but against the likes of WRV and Bloomfield... Ben had to be the man. From a chemistry perspective... he might cause problems, but then again... Joey is maybe the best manipulator of talent I've seen (assuming he could do that as the point forward/PG)... I think he makes it work. Chambers is an interesting argument... offensively he was silky smooth... he played a lot like Shane Miller (Bloomfield). Never looked to be working real hard, but always found ways to score. From an athletic standpoint... I would guess Hale would be better... Of course that is playing against Jared... and watching Hale as an older player. I don't remember seeing him play a game of HS ball.

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You guys are leaving Jeff Oliphant, Tony Patterson, Chad Grounds, Riley Padgett, and Tony Flynn from L & M off of the WRV team.

Plus, you could make a case for Mike Frye, and Stephen Campbell from Worthington.

Rusty Miller comes to mind from Switz City as well.

Edited by 300Game

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You guys are leaving Jeff Oliphant, Tony Patterson, Chad Grounds, Riley Padgett, and Tony Flynn from L & M off of the WRV team.

Plus, you could make a case for Mike Frye, and Stephen Campbell from Worthington.

Rusty Miller comes to mind from Switz City as well.

These names were mentioned earlier in the thread... Jeff Oliphant, Tony Patterson and Rusty Miller are the only 3 that could push to make the top 5 for "WRV". Rusty was a scorer, but because of his size he wouldn't displace any of the Graves' at a guard spot. Plus, almost 50% of his points came from the foul line and the game simply hasn't been played like that for decades... any of the Graves' kids could have averaged 40+ if they got the calls that were made in the 70's...

Regarding this team, Oliphant could slide into the 4 and Patterson could slide into the 3... I would put Matthew back to a guard spot in place of one of his brothers if Patterson slid in. Regardless of how you pick it, a case could be made for about 8 or 9 of them. Not many small schools have an all time top 8 that could play with WRV...

Edited by basketballjones

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Interesting take on officiating in the 70's... I have heard the argument that Rusty would have scored more ppg if there was a 3 point line, but never the officiating differences.

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Interesting take on officiating in the 70's... I have heard the argument that Rusty would have scored more ppg if there was a 3 point line, but never the officiating differences.

I watched the '85 Southridge / L&M game last week... even in the 80's, the game was called so much closer than it is now days.

But yes, Miller would have benefited from a 3 pt line...

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You guys are leaving Jeff Oliphant, Tony Patterson, Chad Grounds, Riley Padgett, and Tony Flynn from L & M off of the WRV team.

Plus, you could make a case for Mike Frye, and Stephen Campbell from Worthington.

Rusty Miller comes to mind from Switz City as well.

I noted my WRV list as post consolidation. Adding Miller, Patterson, Oliphant, to the 6-7 WRV guys already mentioned and trying to decide on a 5 man lineup of G,G,F,F,C makes my head hurt at the thought. Including the pre & post WRV consolidation era's is there a small school in this area or even the entire state that could field a 10 man roster as deep? Without really digging in to look at others, that 10 man roster could have 2 former B10 players, 6 other Division 1 players, a D2 starter on a national champ, and a very good D3 player. At least 6 of those 10 were indiana all-stars I think. Edited by Stroke

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didnt that Central team eventually lose to Damon Bailey and Bedford? Must have been semi state. I think Muncie Central and Chandler Thompson rolled Shawn Kemp's Concord team in the championship game that season.

Don't personally remember but according to my Tourney Time book Central lost to Greencastle in the first round of Semi State.

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Wasn't the Vincennes game when David Litkenhus made the 1/2 court short (or may have been farther)? Or do I have my years and games all mixed up?

Only play I remember from that regional was in the Central game when they got the offensive rebound and put-back to beat us.

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Cathedral:

Walt Sahm 1961

Kenny Barlow 1982

Scott Hicks 1983

Shelton Smith 1984

Collin Hartman 2012

Of course there are other very worthy that aren't mentioned here by me.

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for jasper i will have to go from the 70's up....which i am sure leaves a few great players out. i know at least one from the earlier years made it to the nba. anyways.....scott rolen, michael lewis, mike ballenger, mike leugers and brad voegerl. guard heavy but mike ballenger and brad voegerl or scott rolen could play forward if they had too. i just noticed it is also heavy on the mikes.

Edited by jhswildcat79aks

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Okay I'm sure I'll catch flack from some Bloomfield people on this, but this would be my Cardinal 5:

F- Shane Miller 1994

F- Rick Long 1971

C- Dan McGhee 1961

G- John Bucher 1995

G- Mike Sherrard 1988

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